random intellectual conversations

[agentaaa]

alright, since we have a chat section, I figured we could use it for something more intellectually stimulating than "kitteh" jokes on occasion.
Quite simple, this is a thread devoted to intellectual conversation on any number of issues. We'll try and keep the length of the discussion to arond a week unless it's too interesting to stop.
So, is someone able to suggest a topic?

[Shemuel]

Well, what with the uprisings in Egypt, Libya, Bahrain and Syria, maybe it would be topical to discuss the Arab spring.

What motivates a dictator, and the lengths they sometimes take to remain in control?

[Quantum Rain]

Machievelli's The Prince.

The ends justify the means, and a prince must do all that he can to stay in power.
Furthermore, it is better to be feared than loved.
And people are just generally obsessed with power anyway.

[agentaaa]

Indeed. the main problem with government, is that the people truly motivated to get ahead in it always tend to be the ones interested in the power of it, not serving their people. The governmental systems tend to encourage them, as a matter of fact.
That being said, what motivates a dictator to do all they can to stay in power? Well, I think that specific part is mostly obvious. For many dictators, the only reason they still haven't been shot is BECAUSE they've got the most power of anyone in the country. That's the only reason that Kim Jong-il's a god rather than a demon in the eyes of his people.

[Shemuel]

*bump*

You know, you guys could do with a bit more intellectuality. That is, if you think you're up to it.

[agentaaa]

Well, nobody else seems to be posting. So, time for a topic change.
Pet-related crimes: are they too soft, legally, on the people who commit them?

[Shemuel]

I read an article about that today - apparently dog thefts have rocketed in the US?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-14637989
Strange to think it wasn't illegal until 1966.

What is the current punishment?

[agentaaa]

depends on the stat/province, but here it's just a hefty fine. if it's really bad, you might get a week of jail. that's it.

[Shemuel]

*bump*

[agentaaa]

Seriously? Is no one interested in posting about important real-life issues?

[Shemuel]

Uneducated buffoons!

[agentaaa]

...Fine. I'll make another topic. Hopefully, someone will actually post in this one.

Today, we'll be talking about healthcare. What's your opinion on it, in terms of whether it should be privatized or made public to everyone?

[Shemuel]

Oh, as a European, you Americans confound me.
I can see the argument for privatised healthcare - if you've worked hard, why shouldn't you have the right to better care than a lazy layabout? However, surely everyone should be allowed access to such a thing regardless of their income?

[Quantum Rain]

Morally I would agree, but thinking economically, this is what comes to mind.

More tax to pay for it = less money for people to spend = less profit for employers = less need for employees.

Makes perfect sense. If you wished for healthier people and a higher average life span, than public healthcare is perfect, only problem is is that those people wouldn't have a job to make a living off of. In the reverse, you have less healthier people, lower average life span, but more people have jobs and money, maybe more funds for charities, but, the charity thing is more indirect, usually stemming off of the non-flat tax rates this country has, but, I digress.

Really, the more taxes, the worse you're off, unless your government is Fascist, Totalitarian, Communist, or Socialist. If so, then the government employs everyone anyway, so it wouldn't matter THAT badly. (But there I would talk about incentive, desire, and no one desiring to be creative instead of being a carbon copy of the lazy oaf next door. Imo, patriotism and nationalism only go so far as motivations...)

Back to the subject at hand though. It is in my observations, taking into consideration the tax rates and what the government already does for us now, publicizing healthcare was not the smartest idea. Cut some areas in the budget and make room for such and then I wouldn't mind, but the fact is is that this economy is based of private enterprise, not socialism. High taxes would be rather... detrimental.

[Shemuel]

Ah, but is economy necessarily strongest the further to the right one goes? Keynsian actions seem to fare far better than laissez faire.
I hear what you're saying about healthcare, but the fact is that the government foots the bill for it. The people will still be paid, money won't just evaporate. The NHS here in Britain is the third largest employer in the world (link). In fact, some people will be taxed and splash out for private healthcare, so more money is being rotated around the system.

[Shemuel]

Blathering buffoons!

[agentaaa]

indeed. Personally, as a point of example, Canada's doing, and typically has done, far better economically than America, and we have public healthcare amongst many other things. In all reality, we're taxed about 50$ a month extra for our public healthcare, so it's not a huge issue. Mostly, for the fact that "Privatized" healthcare is less monitored, and prices less controlled. Due to that fact, many operations and the like are overcharged, or, in fact, done despite the fact that they do next to nothing to help the patient, in order to make more. Besides, whether or not you're being taxed, you still need to deal to deal with that disease you've got. Therefore, most people aren't really paying too much more with the taxes, and it's much easier for those too poor to pay for privatized treatment.
Moreso than the economical ramifications, however, I am very morally against a system that gives one such a basic right as being healthy, or dealing with a life-threatening illness, only if you can pay. In a literally life or death situation, one shouldn't need to give money to ask for help. That's just my take on the situation, but it's one of my few moral standards I'm hard to budge about.

[Shemuel]

Incapable idiots!

[agentaaa]

Blithering Churl!


No, but in all reality, we best make a new topic...something revolutionary enough that people will WANT to make arguments about it:

Is violence caused by gaming?
wait, no, no, everyone here qould be united on that one

OKay... gun control!

[Shemuel]

Dunderheaded dunces!

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